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Follow-Fappers and Auto-Clickers
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Travis Apple Offline
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Post: #1
Follow-Fappers and Auto-Clickers

There was a very interesting thread on EF (http://www.entropiaforum.com/forums/show...p?t=60675) that has been ridiculously moderated and then locked. Apparently the previous threads on this topic have been deleted completely but I think this is a very important issue.

Basically the thread starter asks a question about autoclickers and the like but the discussion was unable to come to a conclusion because of over-moderation.

So I’m asking, without threat of moderation, what do you think about autoclickers in the following situations:

1(mining): You’ve hit a 2.5k lyst claim and you now have to bring it all up. That’s 13,000 clicks over TEN HOURS. Autoclick?

2(crafting): You’re trying to unlock bpc and you need to do 200k damper clicks to do it or 280 HOURS. Autoclick?

3(hunting): You’re an uber and want to hunt dasp stalkers. They will take 70 ped of ammo to kill... EACH MOB. Use an autofapper?

On a side note, the new (beta) EU competition AfterWorld (http://www.afterworld.ru/) has autoclicking BUILT IN to the game, or so I’ve been told. Is the lack of user-interface in this area a serious shortcoming to EU? Would the total quality of the user experience be better if we had some way to automate the most boring tasks?

Travis Apple
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2007-03-22 06:58 PM
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Eron Offline
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Post: #2
 

yes it would be sweet to have it built in.

dont be lazy and skill yourself, thats how i have to do it as a low end hunter.

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2007-03-22 07:02 PM
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Kaiser Offline
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Post: #3
 

I agree with AC's in all the above situations. I play afterworld and I have not seen a built in auto clicker. What I have seen though is that if you hold down the button on the mouse the action repeats. Not really an Auto Clicker per se. I did ask the developers of AfterWorld when I met them what they though about AC's and their only response was "they are not needed" yet I continued to use a third party auto clicker even in Afterworld solely for mining.

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2007-03-22 07:05 PM
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Grounder Offline
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Post: #4
 

I have always been against auto clicker where they give an unfair advantage. The problem I have seen is determining when that is.

I know last night I would have loved an auto clicker to pull the mining HoF as it would have saved my aching wrists and fingers and would not have provided any advanage that I am aware of.

However, auto-fapers would seem to indicate the presence of a second ava that provides the auto fap service (as in the EF thread mentioned in the first post). This would suggest a violation of the EULA and present an unfair advanage IMHO. If the two ava were both "manned" not automatons and were teamed this would be different as two ava would be working towards a goal.

Crafting is a tricky one. On the one hand the automation of such a mind numbing and repetative task almost demands a clicker. Yet it could be, and has been, argued that this gives an unfair advantage as the crafters would not need to be at the keybaord to skill and potentialy profit.

I think the auto-clickers are against the EULA and there for I will not use them. If others chose to use them I would not hold it against them but I would hold our achievements in different lights (as I would have worked for mine).

Hmm... perhaps the issue of skill chipping is similar. For a cost the user gets to increase his/her skill without significant personal effort. What do you think?

Grounder

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When feeling lost or unsure of your way find someone who seems to know where they are going and follow them.

You will find that while you rarely get where you wanted to go, you almost always get where you needed to be.
2007-03-22 07:44 PM
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VanBuren Offline
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Post: #5
 

Autoclikers are ok to use in above situations. Even though, I think that game should give to us ability to get rid of boring things. The perfect solution for me is to make use of all materials (like crafting resources, tool etc.) by single click. For instance (based on situations written in first post in this topic):

1. You have found this enormous amount of lyst. Lucky you. You are going to extract it. Single click and as big amount as possible is taken to your inventory within few seconds. Tool decays as if you were mining 'manually', auto-mining is stopped when your inventory is full or tool is broken.

2. You put all required resources in, single click and within few seconds... All resources are used, you achieve amount of items similar to one which you would achieve if you were crafting manually. Everyone is happy! MA got your peds, you got skills, items and lots of time to do other interesting things.

Third situations is bit harder. You can try to use better weapon or FAP (which can burn more PEDs per second Big Grin ). I don't have idea how to improve this area in other way.
2007-03-22 07:57 PM
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Kaiser Offline
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Post: #6
 

To be honest with you having killed a number of daspletors myself, no matter how many HP you have or what weapon you have it would be IMPOSSIBLE to kill one solo. IF you were team hunting them it would be easier. The problem with Dasp is they hit HARD and they NEVER miss EVER. Sooooo as soon as you fap it hits you again before you can even switch to your weapon and get a shot off so you have to FAP again. Even with a mod fap you would be just standing there continuing to FAP.

This in my mind tells me that MA is okay with follow fappers on mobs that are impossible to kill any other way. I have seen Skalman use them, I have seen Star use them, as well as many others who are considered the most skilled in game. In any case on a mob that large it is not an unfair advantage because there are probably less than 100 people in game who still play that are capable of killing these anyway and as far as I know they all have or do use follow fappers.

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2007-03-22 08:03 PM
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dutchie Offline
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Post: #7
 

i have no problems with autoclickers in the first 2 cases. For the last one I don't really know.
autofap could then also be used on medium mobs and would make it easier to kill them.
In the autofap case I would expect that it at least takes the same amount of time. Otherwise it would just be having your hp being permanently fixed to max.
For me part of the fun is the decision on when to fap and when to take a risk and go for another shot.



btw i'm neither a crafter nor a miner, so i never felt the need or desire to use an autoclicker.
but even if you have, do not mention this in this thread. I know MA temp-banned avatars who admitted on EF doing something that was against the EULA.



btw anyone have that link that is edited out on the EF thread?

nevermind, found it already: http://blogtropia.blogspot.com/2007/03/f...ploit.html

mods on EF are not good enough. They removed the link but not a reference to blogtropia which made it a piece of cake to track down the article.

Enjoy!

Dutchie.
2007-03-22 08:23 PM
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Addz Offline
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Post: #8
 

Personally i think that using an autoclicker to play a game rather defeats the purpose. Oftentimes this sort of thing can be defeated all together through game design.

Eg. i dont know how many of you have played world of warcraft, but one thing that they did well was to reduce the need to autoclick by adding it into the game. When blacksmithing to manufacture an item there was an option to press a "craft all" button which would then proceed to craft as many of the given item as you had raw materials for. Not only did this reduce player frustration but also made skilling up faster and easier as well as giving all players within the game an even playing field.

Chuck Norris won 'Jumanji' without ever saying the word.
He simply beat the living shit out of everything that was thrown at him, and the game forfeited.
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2007-03-22 10:28 PM
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Post: #9
 

If in ming your HOf you could set you guy to "extract" with one click. The guy may take ages to extract all of this and you may well be tempted to leave your computer to get a drink or such leaving the ava vulnerable to attack for mob or player. That would make that fairer. One click extracting instantly would not work. Imagine the skills you would get for extracting that 700ped lyst in one click.

Having mobs in the game that can only realistically be killed by a team is fine. Two players, one fapping the other is teamwork. I dont agree with soloing by having a second ava autoclicking the fap button.

Crafting could need a bit more than setting your ava to "craft" for those 200k clicks of dampers. Not sure how.

Overall i feel MA should make tiny changes to make autoclickers obsolete in the game.
2007-03-22 10:51 PM
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Addz Offline
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Post: #10
 

how about while your manufacturing a minigame of pong comes up and you can get a small 1% bonus to the quantity and condiction of your productions depending on how many points you win/lose

then again this could also work for mining have 1 click extract all then just get the resources 1 at a time in a steady stream until its finished.

Chuck Norris won 'Jumanji' without ever saying the word.
He simply beat the living shit out of everything that was thrown at him, and the game forfeited.
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2007-03-22 10:55 PM
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hottygurl Offline
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Post: #11
 

I have to say that in the first two situations I certainly agree with the autoclicker, but on the third that is kinda shady/cheating. If you have a good enough fap to hunt them, then I highly doubt that it would cost much extra to use that fap and if you die while doing it, then you aren't good enough. For boring and repetative tasks where the gain is relatively small for amount of time spent, then I strongly agree that autoclickers should be allowed. Maybe for mining you could have a 'collect all' button where you click it and it gathers as much ore out of the mine as your current miner allows before it decays and then you get the appropriate skill bonuses that you would have gotten otherwise. On the other hand, part of the game that keeps it challenging is this delay so if you had this then ubers could be born in 5 minutes.
2007-03-22 11:39 PM
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Kaiser Offline
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Post: #12
 

In response to dutchie on the gigantic mobs it snot a choice of when to FAP it is a choice of continuously fap and never shoot or be fapped and shoot.

I agree medium mobs this should not be an option but in things like daspletor, it is totally warranted.

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2007-03-23 02:58 AM
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Weyou Offline
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Post: #13
 

I just wouldn't feel right using an autoclicker.

Quote:1(mining): You’ve hit a 2.5k lyst claim and you now have to bring it all up. That’s 13,000 clicks over TEN HOURS. Autoclick?

With a better extractor and some skills this would be a lot easer. I pull up around 50 stones per pull with an OM-104. Brings it down to 5-6000 clicks in 3-4 hours.

It's part of the experience in mining. Big claims are pretty rare for some and standing for ages watching skillgains rack up and hundreds of ped worth of ore slowly filling your window makes it worthwhile. If you were getting those kind of lyst claims all the time you'd probably get a bit cheesed off and look for better markup ores that don't take so long to dig up.

Quote:2(crafting): You’re trying to unlock bpc and you need to do 200k damper clicks to do it or 280 HOURS. Autoclick?

If unlocking skills is the main reason here you can chip in and save some time. I go low level crafting to do something for a while that doesn't cost an arm and a leg. 280 hrs spread over a few weeks/months would make that unlock all the more special.

Quote:3(hunting): You’re an uber and want to hunt dasp stalkers. They will take 70 ped of ammo to kill... EACH MOB. Use an autofapper?

Can't comment much here. I'm not an uber or ever went near anything like this, but you could get a teammate or three to fap you. Or hire someone. Some things just don't sound like mobs you can take on your own. Eomon? Using a fapbot to follow you autohealing crosses the line into cheating imo.

Hmm now autofire I could live with. Holding down the button to reload and shoot. I really want a railgun that fires 300 rounds a minute Smile
2007-03-23 08:37 AM
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raw Offline
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Post: #14
 

Personally I think this should be an option within the game. However, I don;t think it hsould happen instantly. I think it hsould still take the same length of time you just don't have to sit there clicking or pressing a button every 10 seconds!

snake eyes

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1400 / 10, 000
2007-03-23 01:34 PM
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Will Henceforth Offline
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Post: #15
 

I have not used an autoclick or something like that, For crafting and extracting it could be usefull.

But for the Hunt and have bots following you just to heal and not even team up is just plain cheating. If they considder themselve uber but cant fap and shoot of team with 3 ubers or so they aint ubers (I hate that name, And they are only just so skilled because they started the game earlier. While the skills where easier and cheaper to get. And now they are the ones who get all the hofs.) How would they make a Fap bot? just make a 2nd avatar and chip in the medical skills? (they have so much ped anyway so who cares)

I think that MA should punnish the auto fappers, maybe just by banning the 2nd avatars (the chipped skills would cost them) Or even punnish the users, only it cant be directly be related to the "uber" that it is his 2nd avatar.


then again why should all the big hoffs be in those impossible mobs? just to give the uber allot more than he has already (with his cheap skills)

there is also a interresting thread on EF about the skill system, http://www.entropiaforum.com/forums/show...hp?t=59824

like we NEVER can get to that level anymore nomatter how hard we skill.
I think when they changed the skill system to a harder level, they should have taken the amount of skill gains required for the needed points/rank. so the ubers would have been drawn back a couple of points (instead they had 10k points, they now should have 7,5k or so) and they have to skill up just as hard as we have to do now once we pass that level.

Will henceforth be known as Will Convict Henceforth
2007-03-23 02:30 PM
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